Yeah John, I get what you are saying. My theory is largely a mathematical & monetary based buisness principal. In the end, it is figured into the cost of doing buisness which is non-emotional & really not much like yesterdays loyalty. In the old days, people were different. So I do appreciate where you are coming from. On the manufacturing side, I think we have lost some pride too. There are warranties such as Snap On... it is life, quality is there, you will not hear "sorry, I can just sell you a new one at full price"... "just bend over for me real quick". Really you & I are complaining about a similar thing here. I think if a manufacturer makes something that potentially fails, they ought to stand behind it the same way they do their country. At my company, we put an American Flag on it & want you to know where it comes from. On the flip side, we make mistakes too. So- it comes down to how we address them. Sure can't please everyone, but do our best. I get disappointed when I hear of a USA manufacturer who lets down a dealer or consumer.... there are so few now. Scoot